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The Futility of Subjective Beliefs
The Futility of Subjective Beliefs
Richard: I have been a little sidetracked lately discovering that the earth is flat – by checking out the unexamined logic of the natural world. I mentioned it in a mail to James, but he is like the 99,9 of the rest not ready to grasp it, in spite of its overwhelmingly logical an irrefutable evidence. Well, as he said, it is all Maya – anyway – I agree - but quite entertaining.
Well, I love the truth - and I do not like lies.
Flat earth is a mind blower I tell you - but you will need to have the curiosity to go into it. Seeing a couple of videos on Youtube is all it takes really, and an open mind.
Trained in logic thinking through Vedanta can be to your advantage.
Sundari: You are right, neither James or I have time for this stuff because it is of no interest to us. It's all mithya and pointless. And the so-called ‘logic’ regarding the world of objects can be used and abused according to one’s bias. The logic Vedanta uses has nothing to do with proving or disproving anything in the mithya world. It is only taught as a valid means to remove ignorance of your true nature as the Self. Clearly, it also requires knowledge of and common sense regarding the environment we live in. Vedanta reveals why the world of objects is not real and what that means, so the irrefutable knowledge it provides serves to discriminate the Self from the objects that appear in it, not to argue about what is true regarding objects.
Believe whatever idea grabs you about the world of objects, Richard. It matters little, one way or the other, whether the earth is a sphere or not, even though you choosing to believe that the earth is flat is contrary to all credible scientific evidence. It's like the climate change deniers who simply choose to disregard the fact that 99.9% of science states that humans are causing it.
Knowledge of objects (subtle and gross) is not knowledge unless it is true to the object. How is the logic you employ in this regard true to the object? It's not only not logical, if it is “your” or anyone's claim of knowledge, then it is simply an interpretation of an object (subjective reality) which is not necessarily knowledge because you have no way to prove it conclusively. Ignorance (or my point of view) causes me to see or experience objects in a certain way because of “my” conditioning. People believe that ignorance is knowledge because they believe that what they experience is knowledge. It may be knowledge, but it may not be. Our subjective interpretation of experience or any object is not knowledge unless it stands independent of our experience, feelings, beliefs, opinions. Does your claim really stack up to this?
As I said previously, the only way your belief about the earth being flat could be verified and ‘irrefutable’ is if you took a trip up there yourself and proved it, which clearly, is not possible. Why waste time on such nonsense, anyway? How does it help you and what does it prove, I don’t get? I think you are bored and like being a contrarian…
There is only one irrefutable knowledge which is always true and that is Self-knowledge. It is always good because it depends on the nature of the Self, Consciousness—which is always present and unchanging. In fact, it is the only thing that is always present and unchanging. It is true in all three phases of time, past, present, and future and all three states of being, awake, dreaming, and deep sleep. This is fact, not fiction, and true regardless of what you or anyone chooses to believe or say.
Self-knowledge is different from knowledge of objects, which is object-based, not subject based. You cannot be an object for yourself. You are the knower, the subject, so you cannot turn around and become the object. Why? Because objects are not aware, so by becoming an object you stop being the subject. In other words, if you were to become an object, you would stop knowing, stop being aware.
Although Self-knowledge is not based on knowledge gained through personal experience or opinion, it may confirm both, depending on your level of maturity as an inquirer. No other knowledge can negate Self-knowledge. Whereas object knowledge—which is based on experience, feelings, beliefs, and opinions, is always changing and imminently negatable and debatable, fallible, and subject to doubt. Even most consensus scientific thought. So what?
You have a good mind, why waste it... Why not drop all these notions and concentrate on who you are, as the Self?
Please don't write back on this issue if you want to argue about it. We love you no matter what quirky ideas you harbor ...